S6, Ep. 12: Back to SCOTUS: Regular business in disturbing times

Amanda and Holly discuss attacks on the rule of law and the church-state issues in Catholic Charities Bureau v. Wisconsin.

Apr 17, 2025

There has been no shortage of news from all three branches of government in Washington, D.C., but one thing hasn’t changed: the U.S. Supreme Court continues to be interested in religious liberty cases. On today’s show, Amanda and Holly review the recent oral arguments in Catholic Charities Bureau v. Wisconsin, which focuses on a religious exemption in the state’s unemployment compensation laws. There are big questions being asked in this case, such as where one draws the lines, how can “religion” be defined, and what is meant – exactly – by the term “proselytization.” Plus, Holly and Amanda take a moment to step back and talk about the current attacks we are seeing on the rule of law in our country. 

SHOW NOTES
Segment 1 (starting at 00:38): Current state of the courts and various attacks on the rule of law

There are three church-state cases that the Supreme Court will hear this term:

  • Catholic Charities Bureau v. Wisconsin Labor & Industry Review Commission (Oral arguments were March 31)
  • Mahmoud v. Taylor (oral arguments will be April 22)
  • Oklahoma Virtual Charter School Board v. Drummond (oral arguments will be April 30)

 

Segment 2 (starting at 08:00): Oral arguments in Catholic Charities Bureau v. Wisconsin

Visit the website of the U.S. Supreme Court for a transcript and an audio recording of the oral arguments in Catholic Charities Bureau v. Wisconsin

We played a clip from the oral arguments between Justice Neil Gorsuch and Colin Roth, who argued the case as the assistant attorney general for the state of Wisconsin. You can read the exchange beginning on page 81 of the oral argument transcript.

Holly and Amanda mentioned the 2021 case of Fulton v. Philadelphia. Read more about that case on BJC’s website

Read Amy Howe’s coverage of the Catholic Charities case for SCOTUSblog: Supreme Court likely to embrace expanded tax exemption for religious charities

Read Adam Liptak’s coverage for the New York Times: Supreme Court Leans Toward Catholic Charity in Tax Case

 

Segment 3 (starting 26:48): Decision thoughts and what’s ahead

Amanda mentioned the upcoming Oklahoma v. Drummond case. BJC filed a brief in that case, and you can read it on our website.

Respecting Religion is made possible by BJC’s generous donors. Your gift to BJC is tax-deductible, and you can support these conversations with a gift to BJC.

 

A transcript of this podcast will be availble in the coming days — return to this page for the latest.